Black powder & Flash powder

[Jago]

Made for the general discussion of black powder and flash powders. To discuss mixes/compositions, uses and other little tidbits.

[Douchermann]

The three most common:
KClO4/German Blackhead Aluminum (70/30)
KNO3/Magnesium (50/50) use the finest magnesium avaliable (2micron) for the best performance)
Zinc/Sulphur (60/40)
I have made all of those flashpowder, and i'd have to say the 70/30 flash is the best for salutes (out of those 3) because it seems to make more pressure.

[blank stare]

United Nuclear has stopped selling the extra fine aluminum powder because it works so well in flash powders. Next they'll outlaw lettuce because it works so well in salad.
If you have a larger mesh aluminum, would you need more/less oxidizer?

[Random]

Originally Posted by blank stare

United Nuclear has stopped selling the extra fine aluminum powder because it works so well in flash powders. Next they'll outlaw lettuce because it works so well in salad.

ROFL...

[Douchermann]

Same ammount, weight to weight ratio, but it will be hotter and not burn as fast, depending on how much bigger of a mesh you go to.

[Ghettopimp]

How exactly do you use flash and black powder? Also, please describe what exactly will happen.

[K9]

You light them and they burn...

[Kaos-theory]

check out he pipebombmans guide to black powder on the forum a few links back, as i described in it how it burnt and all that

[imtedkaczynski]

Could someone post up a dummy guide? I understand ratios and everything but do I just mix this stuff together and light it on fire or what. Also is it a weight ratio or amount like 1 oz to 1 oz or 1 cup to 1 cup (assiming there is a weight difference.)

[Synchronium]

Ok...

All quantities are by weight. 70/30 would mean 70g for every 30g. Unless specified in whatever article you read always assume it's by weight.

Flash Powder
Weigh out your metal (Al, Mg) and your oxidiser (XNO3, XClO3, XClO4, XMnO4, etc), and grind down the oxidiser into a fine powder if it's not already. You'll have a hard job grinding your metal down any further, so the only real way to make decent flash is to buy prepowdered metals. When you have both prepared, pour them onto a large (double layer) sheet of newspaper and pull opposing corners up to meet eachother. Lower them back down and repeat with the other corners. Continue this process (it takes a while...) until the mix is homogenous. You could also stick everything in a bag and mix it together with your hands, btu this is the most advisable method.

The finer your flash, the faster it'll burn. Usual flash powders look like just that, a slivery powder that gets everywhere. It's incredibly fine, but not too hard to handle provided you posess a little dexterity. A thin trail of unconfined flash powder will burn rapidly (and I mean rapidly) with a brilliant white light. If you make any attempts to confine it however, it will more than likley make a rather loud bang with a brilliant flash of light. If you've ever seen those old photographers with the hooded cameras that hold little stands, which they pour FP onto and ignite to produce enough light for the photograph, you'll get an idea of how this stuff burns. Granted, that FP is not chemically the same as the stuff we usually use, since it also contains strontium & barium to balence out the colours (since FP is usually bluish).

You'll only need a small amount to do whatever with. Anything more than about 5g is overkill and you're just wasting your powder.



Black Powder
BP is made from charcoall, sulphur and an oxidiser (usually KNO3). Use whatever ratios your recipe suggests (by weight of course) and grind up, or ball ill if possible, all your ingredients individually. Once you have three tubs ow powdered ingredients, mix them together in a similar manner to the above. Once mixed together, it'll look like a browny black powder that can and will get everywhere. In my experience I've never managed to get pure black charcoal, but it's always been just as good as pourchased stuff. Now, depending on what you want, you can use this powder as is or you can "corn" it; a process designed to standardise the stuff you work with. Corning involves wetting and pressing (with loads of pressure) your powder into little hard cakes. The cakes are then broken up into little "crumbs", which are seived using a number of specific mesh screens, resulting in a number of different particle sizes. Finer stuff will burn faster and larger stuff, a little bit slower. Commercial corning also includes dusting the pellets with graphite to reduce friction when handling (IE sliding them into tubes).

Black powder will burn with an orange flame, full of particulates. This burns a lot slower than flash. When compressed in casing, it might make a bang, or it might just pop the lid off, since BP is used for lifting more than exploding. To use properly, poor a small amount into a tube, add a fuse, wadding and projectile and ignite. The projectile will be sent into the air rather than the tube exploding, as would be the case with FP.

Other things you can do with BP are making black match, a semi reliable slow burnign fuse and BP covered sawdust, a tool used to dampen the explosive effects of BP even more - used to explode open firework shells in mid-air - if BP were used alone, it would more than likley shatter the stars inside, but the coated sawdust only pushes them out into the sky.


There ya go.

[imtedkaczynski]

Sweet thanks. And any warnings? like is it bad to look at these flashes form FP, also if needed could i make my own metal, like using a benchgrinder or something, and just let it collect onto something?

And how would I be able to change the color, if possible.

[Kaos-theory]

FP flashes arnt that bad, i burned everythgin i made BP/FP etc on my window sill and watched from 2 ft away lol as pure powder(unconfined) confined, its a different matter bp dosent do much fp wil blind for a second depding on how much there is

[Douchermann]

It depends how far away you are, like you said unconfined from 2 ft away wont do crap, unless its at night when you eyes are adjusted to the darkens, and you light a small pile of 50:50 flash with a blowtorch that your friend let you use because I inspired him to get one. Also at night, if you are like a couple 100ft away from a 250gram flashpowder salute with really thick cardboard and wooden endplugs because my dads friend was there and hes a total pyro, you also will not get bothered.

[imtedkaczynski]

so a gram scale would be nice to have right?

[DREX]

I recomend scales acurate to 0.1g.

[Synchronium]

Not really necessary. 1g should be enough. If you're making any usable ammount of powder, being .5g either side of the ideal won't make much difference.

If you're worrying about a precision of 0.05g, you'd better have analytical grade reagents to back it up.

[Suigeneriz]

Could i get all of the ingridients that i need to make BP in my house, or are there things that i need that usualy are in a home? Like KNO3, that`s fertilizer? Sulfur, that`s matches? Charcoal, that`s wood coal?

[Wurm]

Originally Posted by Suigeneriz

Could i get all of the ingridients that i need to make BP in my house, or are there things that i need that usualy are in a home? Like KNO3, that`s fertilizer? Sulfur, that`s matches? Charcoal, that`s wood coal?

Match heads, are for the most part not sulfur. The biggest ingredient in the heads of matches is antimony sulfide, next is an oxidizing agent such as potassium chlorate, followed by sulfur or charcoal. You can buy relatively pure sulfur in any plant store though. And not all fertilizer is KNO3. So read up on your ingredients list.

[S25]

Wurm I am sure that was a typo on your behalf but pottasium chlorate and sulphur is dangerous!Touch sensitive.....
Look for fertiliser with the NPK value of 13 - 0 - 45 you can also try Grants Stump remover and varios stump removers there should be a warning on the side....
Charcoal you can make yourself basicaly cut some willow and debark put all in a biscuit tin and put a hole in the top of the biscuit tin then put on a heat source,You should see clear fumes emmiting from tin,They are flamable....
When the fumes stop cover whole on tin to stop the willow from lighting and dont open for a few hours to allow for it to cool down.
Sulphur you can get that at a garden center as Yellow Sulphur or Dusting sulphur.

[Suigeneriz]

NPK? Debark?

[headcase]

NPK is a value on every bag of fertilizer. Don't worry about what it means. (The ratio of nitrogen, phosperous and potassium if you need to know).

De-bark, remove the bark.

[CecilBDemented]

What would be better to use for small fun sized explosions, flash powder or black powder?

[headcase]

That's a pretty aimless question.

Whichever one you can make/get easier.

[pyroblaze]

where can i get get magnesium, an oxidizer, and aluminum powder

[Blackerninja]

So would Kno3 be a suitable oxidizer for Flash Powder?

[Kataklysm]

Yes it would but don't forget to grind it up a little if you get it via tree stump remover.

[Widigo]

I'm all but lost, can I have the commercial names of the products I will need for BP?

There are so many chemical names here I'm lost. LOL!

I will need:

Charcoal (Will artists grade work, I'm an artist I have that)

Grants Stump Remover ("NPK value of 13 - 0 - 45" would this be on the label somewhere?)

Sulfur (where can I find that and what's a common American brand name?)

[3rddegree]

for Sulfur just ring garden stores and ask if they have "Flowers of Sulfur" which is sulfur powder.

Hey guys I've made my BP but it burns too slow ... any ideas... heres a vid (lol at my bad camera work )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0n_2CjRAhQ

[ATSACIN]

Originally Posted by 3rddegree

for Sulfur just ring garden stores and ask if they have "Flowers of Sulfur" which is sulfur powder.

Hey guys I've made my BP but it burns too slow ... any ideas... heres a vid (lol at my bad camera work )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0n_2CjRAhQ

It leave some burned things in the table? Mine left a time ago, and burned the table, make a paste with the blackpowder by mixing with water, and make the kno3 dissolve, then let it dry in a hot place, in a sunny day is good, but not in the sun light, leave it in a open tuperware with paper on top, mix the past some times (around 10 min. between), when it is almost dry leave the open container inside the house, for some days.

I do this with mine and work well, not the best, but is good, if this don't work try use a soft charcoal.

If is anything wrong of what I write please anyone tell me.

[freetec]

what if anything can be substituted instead of zinc in the 50/50 ratio of zinc and sulfur? what will be better in a M-80 style of small explosive: flash or black powder? im thinking flash cause it wioll det. faster.