C-4 plastic explosive

[needzhelp]

first question, is c-4 or any variant (PE4,T4) easy to make? How do i make C-4 or any variant listed above? were do i get the ingredients? C-4 is the safest powerful explosive to my knowledge, is there anything safer or is easier to make that may mach the power of c4? i want around 1 pound.
thanks

[AgentApoc]

Yeah there's this real cool easy to make explosive, it's called UTFSE and stop being a k3wl idiot, you might want to look it up. Also the "ingredients" as you call them are impossible for someone of your level to accquire, I bet you don't even know the explosive C-4 is made with.

[needzhelp]

it's called UTFSE and stop being a k3wl idiot, you might want to look it up.

um i just registered 5min ago because i was searching for how to make it and did not find it so registered here to get an answer. Wikipedia gave me some basic knowledge but not enough. If you know a site just give me a link. I research before i go asking!!!

[AgentApoc]

If you had done any decent amount of research you would know exactly how C-4 is made. All I will spoonfeed to you is that RDX is the explosive used in C-4, you will not be able to make this at your skill level so I suggest you drop the whole "k3wl c4 plastic explosive" and read through some of the threads here and on various other sites. I doubt you even know how C-4 would be set off if by some miracle you had some of it.

[needzhelp]

you will not be able to make this at your skill level so I suggest you drop the whole "k3wl c4 plastic explosive" and read through some of the threads here and on various other sites..

I told you i have a basic knowledge of it it is rdx, plastic binder, and plasticizer. i just need some instruction on proportions, combining the ingredients, and obtaining the ingredients.

I doubt you even know how C-4 would be set off if by some miracle you had some of it

c4 is very safe and is hard to detonate and needs a powerful blasting cap!

[AgentApoc]

Right if you already knew that then there should be no reason for you to make this thread. The synthesis of RDX has already been discussed here many times.

[needzhelp]

dude forums are made to help people, i would appreciate it if you would start doing so, thanks. can you please give me a links i searched the forum already

[AgentApoc]

Yes they are, but not for helping people with questions that have been answered 1000 times before. I searched "Synthesis of RDX" in google and found plenty of information, I suggest you do the same. Actually since you said please I will help you out. PM me your email and I will send you a book with a good synth.

[needzhelp]

you were right when you said i am just a beginner but i finished ap chem in 11th with a 96 avg but the Google stuff was too complex for me. i did find something that x-ray cat posted but when i clicked on a link he created for rdx syn link it said account suspended...?

[AgentApoc]

That's because the site the link was from has now been shut down unfortunatly.

[X-ray Cat]

Guys, is there another C-4 thread allready? Our search function sucks monkeyballs.. I tried to search C-4 aswell as RDX but nothing showed up.
Anyhoo, if there isn't a C-4 thread some minor adjustments to this thread could make it into one. Et Presto!!


Ps, the links in the thread seased to work due to roguesci being knocked down.. However, there are mirrors of the site on piratebay:
Roguesci Forum/Controversial Chem Lab Mirror (download torrent) - TPB

Or just check it out here without downloading, lol:
Megalomania's Explosives Section

So there you should be able to find most understandable information on explosives needzhelp. Check for the chemlab section. Apoc, atleast this guy did a bit of research which at least makes him not a typical knownothing lol.

I'll look up a good RDX synth for ya bro. From the easiest possible chemicals. Do you have nitric acid?


PS II:
There actually WAS a C-4 thread
C4

That one however hasn't much info no the subject though.. Problem is that our search engine can't do searches for words less than a couple of letters. C-4 and RDX are too short to search :S










Review
How to produce C-4 from the most easy available items.

Author:
X-ray Cat

Resources:
Websites:
- Megalomania's Method of Making Hexamethylenetetramine Dinitrate
- Alen G's website, but it has been down for ages, got it on paper though.

Books:
"Chemische Preparaten" by Drs. L.P. Edel - AE. E. Kluwer, Deventer, 1936

Part I
Synthesis of RDX from scratch.

Chemicals needed:
Water
Sodium Bicarbonate
Acetone
Ammonia 5% (household ammonia)
Formaline 37% (formaldehyde solution)
Nitric acid weak (53% or even lower will work)
**can be substituted by Hydrochloric acid and nitrate salt, this method will also be described in section I-b
Nitric acid strong (>90%, red fuming nitric will work but will increase the chance of runaway reaction and decrease yield)
** Can be produced by an improvised distilling setup described in earlier thread: read that guy's post in this thread:
Nitric Acid....
in which he describes this setup for the production of nitric acid:
Image:Formic-condenser.jpg - HomeChemistry
Which will work fine for the production of nitric also, with other chemicals in the setup ofcourse..


Apparatus needed:
Glass beakers (borosylicate are best, varying sizes fitting the desired volume)
Glass stirring rod (magnetic stirrer is optional)
Glass or other acid and acetone resistant filter
Filter Paper
Measuring beaker
Hot plate or other trustworthy heatsource (frying pan, etc, be carefull with open fire)
Glass thermometer
Icebath
Waterbath

++++++Section I-a, synthesis of hexamethylenetetramine (hexamine, methanamine, all the same product)++++++
In a glass beaker, mix 162 ml 37% formaline with 700 ml 5% ammonia. Stir this mixture well for 15 minutes and let it sit for 1 to 2 hours, some heat is formed in this reaction, but not too much. Heat this mixture on a hotplate to 100 degrees or a bit higher and boil of the liquid. When allmost all liquid is gone and the mixture is turning into a slurry heat a little bit more carefull as otherwise splattering will occur. Once all the liquid has been evaporated you're left with dry hexamine crystals.


++++++Section I-b, synthesis of hexamethylenetetramine dinitrate++++++
Megalomania's Method of Making Hexamethylenetetramine Dinitrate
Or copied:

Hydrochloric acid and nitrate salt method:
Dissolve 14 g (0.1 mol) of methenamine in 50 mL of warm water in a 250-mL beaker. Place the beaker of solution into a salt-ice bath and cool it to 5 °C or less. Measure out 20 mL (0.314 mol) of 70% nitric acid into a small test-tube or beaker and cool the acid in the ice bath as well. It is not necessary to use 70% acid as long as the proper molar amount is added, just limit the amount of water the methenamine is dissolved in accordingly if dilute acid is used. Slowly add the nitric acid, with stirring, to the methenamine solution at such a rate as to keep the temperature below 5 °C. The addition of the acid should cause the immediate precipitation of product. Continue stirring a minute after all of the acid has been added to insure complete precipitation, and then pour the mixture over a vacuum filter to collect the crystals. Hexamethylenetetramine dinitrate can be decomposed by water into formaldehyde in short order, so no extra time should be taken. Wash the crystals with several portions of dry acetone or anhydrous ethyl alcohol to remove any last trace of acid and to accelerate drying. Place the crystals in a desiccator to dry. Store in a tightly closed vial to protect from moisture. You will need a graduated cylinder for measuring liquids, a stirring rod or magnetic stirrer for mixing, and a thermometer to monitor the temperature.


Nitric acid method:
An alternative to using nitric acid in this synthesis is to use a nitrate salt and hydrochloric acid. The yields may be a bit less, but the result is the same. Instead of preparing a hexamine solution, prepare a nitrating solution by dissolving 28 g (0.35 mol) of ammonium nitrate in 80 mL (0.8 mol) of 31.45% hydrochloric acid in a 250-mL beaker. Cool this solution in a salt-ice bath to 0 degrees. Again, it is not necessary to use the specified concentration of hydrochloric acid as long as the proper molar amount is added. Dissolve 14 g (0.1 mol) of methenamine in a minimum amount of water (about 21 mL). Quickly add this solution to the nitrating mix with rapid stirring; a precipitate should soon form. Filter and wash the crystals as above. One could substitute sodium nitrate or potassium nitrate of the same molar mass in place of ammonium nitrate.

***Both pathways described above (copied from megalomania's controversial chemlab) result in the same product, HDN. HDN is said to be carcinogenic. It also is hygroscopic like a bitch and the crystals are very fine so they'll stick around easy, bad combi for a suspected carcinogen.


++++++Section I-c, synthesis of RDX++++++
Originally taken from AlenG's website and edited:
Before starting prepare an icebath and an ice-dumpbucket (or a combi) for cooling and emergency situation and do this procedure in a well ventilated area. The fumes released are toxic and should not be inhaled. Also wear glasses, protective clothing and have sodium bicarbonate standby for any acid accidents.

To a glass beaker add 72 grams of concentrated nitric acid and slowly, while carefully monitoring the temperature, add 24 grams of HDN to this (the described amount of acid used here is calculated for 95% nitric so maybe crank up the amount a bit if you're using lower concentrations..) Do the addition slowly and monitor the temperature well keeping it between 25-30 degrees celsius. On addition of some of the HDN to the acid you'll initially see and hear some "hishing". It's better to keep the temp low at 25 celsius as when using unpure nitric acid, runaway reactions can and will happen here if care isn't taken. Whenever you see signs of the reaction going into runaway status (sudden quick temperature rises or temperatures higher than 30 degrees) COOL IMMEDIATLY by putting the beaker in the icebath, also immediatly stop addition of the HDN. If the temperature goes down, wait for it to settle back at 25 degrees celsius, then continue but go slowly. If the temperature doesn't drop but keeps rising and red fumes start to pop up out of the beaker and the liquids turn brown/red, DUMP the whole beaker into the icebath or ice-dumpbucket (which means pour everything thats in the beaker into the ice water). Highly toxic red smoke will go up on doing this, but the reaction will come to a stop. You can try to see if there's any crystal product in the icebath that you might be able to take out.

If everything goes right:
Once all the HDN has been added heat the solution to 50-55 degrees for 5 minutes. Do this by using a hot water bath (just a tile fulled with hot water). If the temp reaches 55 degrees cool it back to 50 degrees by using a warm water bath. If it hits the 50 degrees warm it up again with the water bath. Repeat this process for 5 minutes. Then cool the mix to 20 degrees celsius and let it sit for 10 minutes. Now the solution is poured into 200 ml nearly freezing water (distilled ofcourse). You should see the white RDX crystals form (extremely fine powder). Filter these crystals out by pouring everything through the filter (use double filter papers as the acids might atack it). Wash these crystals by putting them to a beaker with 100ml 10% bicarbonate solution and finally with 100ml of distilled water. You must then purify the RDX by adding the crystals to a beaker and dissolve them in the smalles amount needed of hot acetone possible. Just add some acetone, heat it to near boiling and stirr well, check if everything has dissolved and if not, add a bit more acetone. Do this untill everything has just dissolved (you should see some white precipitate form on the sides of the beaker due to evaporation of the acetone after stirring). Then pour the acetone/RDX solution into a beaker with another 200ml or more of freezing cold water. The RDX will form and can be filtered and dried.



Part II The production of C-4
researching at the moment...

[willi-wurm]

i always thought it was 80 percent RDX, 10 percent PETN and the other 10 percent plasticisers and binders.

do you have any previous experiences with explosives?

i think it takes a long time to get the plasticisers and binders, and this would probably be harder than the actual PETN or RDX. you do realize how long it would take and how expensive it would be? couldnt you just use your time to make something... a little less... ahem tricky?

[needzhelp]

thanks for the book agent apoc and the links and info X-ray cat provided are very informative! i will start this prosedure sometime in the next two weeks,

I'll look up a good RDX synth for ya bro. From the easiest possible chemicals. Do you have nitric acid?

yes i know how to make it from a vid on youtube if anyone needz the link here it is:YouTube - Make Nitric Acid - The Complete Guide. thanks very much!!!!!

also im new to this so i need sum glassware. I did find a few sets but not what i need, If anyone knows of a good deal please tell me >$100 thanks

[X-ray Cat]

Aside from beakers there's not much else that you need..

Did you see the improvised nitric acid distilling setup I put in my last post? Ofcourse a distilling setup would do much better but that's only if you've got the option...

You can use "pyrex" beakers. Not as good as the labstuff, but they can stand some heat change...

http://www.plancookeat.com/store/pro...ure__94683.jpg
they look like that..., most stores where you can buy your kitchen needs (frying pans etc) have them.





Review continued:

Part II The production of C-4
Still researching...
But temporarily:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C-4_(explosive)

Assuming this information from wikipedia is accurate you could mix those chemicals and you'd be set. Improvised C-4 can be made by replacing the plasticizer with crude motor oil...

[needzhelp]

Assuming this information from wikipedia is accurate you could mix those chemicals and you'd be set. Improvised C-4 can be made by replacing the plasticizer with crude motor oil...

how about the binder usually Butyl rubber, were or how do i get that?

[X-ray Cat]

I though I should add this little film, not mine btw, but it shows that little hishing flame that you will never forget once you've seen it,

RDX burning:
YouTube - RDX Deflagration/Burn Test

[Timm]

ETN, made by the double batch in a freezer, loosely capped with nitrile gloves over the tops.. filtered product washed, melt-washed with hot water, dissolved in solvent with bicarbonate and recrystalized. One canning jar, a wooden dowel, a hint of lighter fluid and one sticky glue mouse trap (fuck extracting ticky-tack or self-amalgamating tape!) ...Is one way to improvise a pretty sweet plastic. Use it to hold a piece of melt-cast ETN (a "power-pellet"!) to a metal target, great lil system.

I keep it in lil play-doh containers with a white lid, usually in my pocket.. cap or two safely tucked away in my backpack.. mountain bike, whiskey, few beers, some spraypaint, bit of weed, m-80 or four and a big white smokebomb. We call it thursday!! Sometimes i love this place.

[needzhelp]

I though I should add this little film, not mine btw, but it shows that little hishing flame that you will never forget once you've seen it,

yeh i had already seen that one and about a dozen other c4/rdx vids. C4 is the "stuff"!

[Timm]

Its fun to hammer lil bits of the plastic on concrete next to a slug or some other doomed insect you've put on there.. kind of like tiny blast effect/frag tests! Fun stress reliever.

Wear earplugs though, especially if you're striking bits of cast ETN, a peppercorn sized piece can be pretty friggen loud. Eye protection is a clear requirement as well.

Here's some..

[uchiacon]

Dude, did you know that peppercons are actually grown on a pepper vine?

[Timm]

Definately still on topic, but yeah they're berries at one point, right?

[uchiacon]

Someone elaborate on that plastic shit that was obtained from sticky shit to make win?
I think the hardest part to c4 could be getting the butyl rubber..

[X-ray Cat]

isobutylene rubber, isn't it? Can order it per kilo.. think you'll have to look for china to get a good supplyer though.

[Timm]

The Sticky is easy.. You go to practically any giant store and buy one box of sticky glue mouse traps (these are quite brutal already, but just wait) Take them home, open them, get a short and strait-sided glass jar out (like a half-pint) and your dry, pulverent, hard-to-handle explosive. You will also need a spoon and some lighter fluid.

This shit is -SO- sticky its practically impossible to weigh in tiny amounts, so i usually just wing it, but thats cause i'm pro and know how to make it happen. There are two methods of getting the sticky out of the tray and around your explosive particles, one involves just melting out enough on a stick or spoon to put in your jar for a lil batch, and just working in the powdered 'splosive bit at a time until you get a homogenous product. The other way is to get a spoon, wet it with the lighter fluid, and scrape the works out and into a small tupperware container. You will need to squirt some on and around the sticky for this to work, and to re-wet the spoon often with the lighter fluid which will help it to not stick to the spoon as much. I hate getting this stuff on my hands, best to wear gloves, but it will come off with coleman fuel or more lighter fluid (same thing basically, lighter fluid is just more pure) this takes a bit of practice to work, but you'll figure it out. The idea is to get the bulk of it into the tupperware where you can cover it with VM&P naptha, or coleman fuel if you don't have that, it just stinks more. You may have to warm it a bit to get it to solvise, heat gun if you're extremely aware of fumes and their explosion risk, otherwise just leave it on a high shelf in the furnace room with the lid on tight.

So! You then take a small amount of this runny sticky liquid, and put it in your half-pint jar, enough to cover the bottom, but thats about it. Then hit this with a heat gun on low (or your sisters hair dryer or whatever, lacking that, just let it sit somewhere warm for a while) until most of the solvent is gone, cause its kind of a bitch to get out later. Then just add your powdered 'pow and work it in with the dowel, and roll it on the sides, it'll get all sticky, then you add a bit more... and repeat.. and stir.. and repeat.... It will stick to the sides alot, just push it back down, and keep working it in, remember, we're shootin for 90% 'splosive to glue by weight, but even if you don't get that (which we probably won't), it should work fine if there's enough in there. It may well look like all you're getting is a jar of white shit stuck to the sides, but keep after it. The residual solvent, while helping to facilitate mixing, destroys any cohesive putty-like behavior until it is totally gone. When it begins to wrap around the dowel, you're gettin somewhere, you may be able to take it out and squish it into a ball, but this will likely crumble to bits when handled. Back into the jar with it! More ETN or whatever, stir, add, ect. If its crumbly, crumble over a thick piece of paper or similar and leave it somewhere warm and dry, should help alot in getting out the last bit of solvent. I've had stuff whose handling characteristics improved quite a bit just by "aging" undisturbed in open air over a couple or few weeks.

This works for me, see picture a few posts back. Severed a dog chain with a marble-sized ball of it last night, was fun! The chain was kinda pussy (~1/4" steel) , it would have done a standard 3/8" grade 70 truck chain no problem.

[ninefingers]

Originally Posted by needzhelp

how about the binder usually Butyl rubber, were or how do i get that?

Iv'e heard of cutting a hole in an old basketball and splashing some acetone around in it an hour to get some PBTE. It seems lame. I'm trying soakeing bits, and inner tubes pieces, over night. The Basketball had a thin, shiny inside sealing layer, the rest was apparently fiberglass and steel wires in another sort of rubber.

[needzhelp]

Part II The production of C-4
researching at the moment...

I made RDX finally....took for ever. I made two batches. One small quantity just test it, then the second a little lager (27g) for the actual C-4.
I'm on part II bro, just need some guidance.

[X-ray Cat]

Ehmzz deee.. geez... thats kinda quick ey for a dude who started out a couple weeks ago. darnit. Well to be honest, i'd love to give you part two but I haven't yet done much research. could anyone fill in here with the original contents of C-4 and improvised versions?? as I'm kinda empty handed here.. I never took the hassle since making the RDX into C-4 only weakens the explosive.. It does make it kneadable and sticky but i've never found that a necessary property for it. It's fun to do though..

All I know is that you need that isobutylene-rubber and that sebacate stuff. What's else in it beats me. Guess the procedure for it isn't much more than mixing em all together.

In the meantime you can also try to make DDNP since you are pretty handy so it seems. Much safer than AP (in case you still haven't switched to a better primary). You need aspirine, nitric, sodium hydroxide, sulfuric acid, sulfur and sodium nitrite (not nitrate). Please be very carefull with all the stuff you produce ey.. Also the ddnp synth works with phenol and derratives.. don't inhale that shit. dont touch it either.

[STS-103]

Good plasticizers and binders

[Timm]

I didn't learn much from that link. And did no one notice the recipe i posted for making a suitable plastic? It probably doesn't hold up as well next to a military product, but since i will never know for sure, i think it kicks ass. It takes away steel on about a volume/volume basis, up to about 1.5 or higher ratio under the most favorable conditions. I haven't done large amounts of it on tough, thick targets as its manufacture is quite labor intensive. Two ounces is fun like four or five times.