totse, bombshock and the hoards of idiots...

[xpl0siv]

For those that do not know what totse is i will quote from the wikipedia entry:

"TOTSE (IPA: ['tɒt-si][1], commonly mispronounced as "tout-see," "toat-see," and "toats," IPA: ['tots]) was a San Francisco Bay Area website and former BBS dedicated to storing text files on a variety of subjects and viewpoints, many of which were unusual or controversial. The name is an acronym for Temple of the Screaming Electron."

In short, totse was a website dealing with fringe texts and discussion through forums - much like bombshock

Totse has closed its doors. Jeff's had enough. I'd like to quote Jeff's farewell letter with the following extract:

"I don't think it will come as a shock to most of you that after 20 years I am burned out. For the last several years I've reduced the time I spend on the site to the bare minimum -- paying bills, finding advertisers, maintaining the servers, fixing database problems, debugging e-mail server problems, handling SPAM, and answering the occasional question or mediating a random dispute, but even that takes 10 to 20 hours a month. It's time to do something different. It's time for something new."

I honestly thought i'd never see this day. Totse was the "original" underground bbs, and a great deal of young punks spent hours writing about, reading about and living out a vast array of fringe activities. farewell!

I have to admit, i feel very sympathetic towards Jeff's point of view. Growing up is a hard game, and the more time you spend getting on with life, the more you start to understand "how it all works". I'm not surprised Jeff has pulled the plug. Fringe forums - stuck between a rock and a hard place...

Building pyrotechnics has always been an enjoyable hobby of mine, as is studying and building improvised weapons. I enjoy intelligent discussion revolving around the philosophies of mankinds organisation - read:governments. I have a very open mind and originally bombshock reflected my quest for meeting like minded and interesting people to talk with.

At a time where i was growing up and gaining new understanding into the realities of the world, branching out into many different activities, sports and travel, i was naturally encouraged to restrict the freedom of discussion on bombshock. Ultimately, this website is my responsobility, and i cant allow the loose discussion of "homemade bombs" for example, no matter how innocent, to be associated with me personally. Its just not worth the risk to me.

It is timely that totse has been axed as i see a number of "new" forums born. I've seen them all before. Entheusiastic punters break off and form their own "perfect" refined forums, dragging a few members off to develge and discuss their "underground" secrets. It is an interesting paradox. We simply cant discuss topics which once, we had the freedom to. Sept 11 introduced a new level of confinment to the freedom to discuss what one chooses. I, naturally worked toward eliminating the topics of conversation that could be potentially aligned with "terrorist activities". Trying to control the drivel, bitching, moaning, complaining, arguing, flaming...

Instead of a reference for information and a medium for intelligent discussion ANY forums trying to cover a broad range of topics fall into a class of forums i have come to recognise as "culture forums", that is, the culture is what draws and repells people rather that the content. Through the years there have been more and more points of reference on the internet to bombshock, leading to more and more visitors. The world has grown with bombshock. What were once fringe topics in the news are now mainstream - anarchy, emo, punk, rebel all used interchangably pointing to an underground "culture" that is now above ground. Its fashionable to be an outsider.

Welcome to the internet. get yourself a facebook account and ohh, dont forget to signup with a forum that suits your personality type. you a punk or rebel? try bombshock...

Every now and then i feel motivated to move the forums toward a fresher direction, taking into account where i am now in my life. Hell, i have pages and pages of scribbles with hundreds of ideas on how to improve. Then i flick through a few threads and the bitching and moaning, and stuck up attitudes drag me back to earth. i close my browser window and stuff my ideas back into my bottow drawer.

Obviously these forums generate no revenue, they are entirely funded by other web projects i run. Because they generate no income they are entirely expendable, but why take them down? So that is where bombshock now sits really. A paradox which is "underground forums".

I've noticed a few older regulars have formed together to start another spin-off. The level to which you are incriminating yourselves is at the least nerve-racking. Remember shadowcrew? a carding forum is not a good start. Mac's Comprehensive '09 Outdoor Grow Guide Coming January 2009? I truely must be getting old. General random thread, who would win in a fight... blah blah blah. i feel like i should be saying good luck - but i really wouldnt mean it. Yes i take notice of whats written on bombshock.

Yes i know how many spinoffs have spawned from bombshock. Its funny all the visitors your websites get from links you've posted on bombshock but you aren't even big enough to tell everyone on your own sites where you got the idea and most of the initial members from, yes revelation x i'm talking about you. yes rorta i'm talking about you. yes aotu i'm talking about you amongst the others... Yes i know there are no burned bridges but why do you continue to come back if you are not willing to post a link to bombshock on your website? I'm genuinely curious.

The sheer amount of time some of the members of bombshock spend writing plain drivel does simply not make sense. Flame wars lasting hundreds of posts. immature egos let free to talk up their significance to all that will listen. And it seems many do. I'm not naming names but all these writers need to get out in the real world and practice what they're preaching. When you grow older you'll look back at your wasted days in front of the screen - shaking your fists and writing intensely with all the rage of a puberty stricken boy and just shake your head. go outside, get some sun, do SOMETHING! ANYTHING! You ask me where i am and complain that i'm not administrating the forums. I don't have anything in common with you. I do stuff, in the real world. I don't preach, i practice. no talk, just do. That may make me a shit forum administrator but hell, i pay the bills don't i. I enjoy reading the 20% of posts on here that mean something and that is the sole reason why these forums are still online.

So for those of you that feel like i'm talking about you, i probably am. And if your still reading this there is a high chance i AM talking about you - funny that.

There are, of course, exceptions and its those people that make it all worth while!

And now i'm off to bed. Thats enough of a rant for now.. So goodbye totse and good move Jeff. your website was rubbish - in the nicest possible way.

Xpl0siv

[headcase]

Like I said before, Bombshock's high page rank and accessibility is a blessing and a curse. It maintains the member turnover necessary to stop the forums stagnating but makes idiotic questions and stupid discussion almost inevitable. Remember, we're the number one hit on Google if you search for "homemade bombs".

That said, you seem to take an undeservedly bleak view. While I'm not sure what "new direction" you had in mind, the Philosophy section is thriving and the Politics section has it's moments (look at sacrenines or CyberWar). FerretBone can answer pretty much anything in the Weapons section and X-Ray Cat is holding the Explosives section together. We seem to have taken a mantle on Fake ID discussion and Beyond has a number of lockpicking qualifications. And that's to name just a few. There are a lot of fools too but there's also a huge middle-ground. Dozens of young people with a brain and a willingness to learn, if not the polished rhetoric of the elders. We all have a rose-tinted view of the past and I'm as guilty of succumbing to nostalgia as much as anyone but the assumption that it was great then and is shit now I believe is completely groundless. There's just more shit on the internet in general.

__

As regards the Bitching section, I think the whole thing was a mistake and I'd delete it now if I could. No good can or will ever come from it. Hint hint.

__

We also discussed appointing some new moderators to the Fringe sections to maintain a standard there that neither Random nor I can because we don't have the specialist knowledge. We had written up a shortlist but the situation has changed since then. I'll bring it up with Random again but there's a thread in the mod section with most of the information.

[Macaveli]

Originally Posted by xpl0siv

Yes i know there are no burned bridges but why do you continue to come back if you are not willing to post a link to bombshock on your website? I'm genuinely curious.

Ok, before I get on to this quote I'll step up and say something else first.

Being a dedicated member for over 7yrs I completely agree with your assesment. I also agree with the fact that through time more and more idiots have been allowed to roam this forum and run this forum. Yes, I'm speaking directly about your supermoderator elect. Though in your eyes my opinion doesn't matter as yours doesn't matter to me, it still does not deter from the fact that majority of the senior members on here are SICK of this place.

Thousands of hours and Years spent on this forum and senior members in no way get respected. Even by a fucking SM who has been around less then half of us. To be here for that amount of time and be told that we are not needed is a shot in the face.

Now, onto this quote I pulled from your little essay. There was a point where I would have never even attempted to create a fringe forum strictly for the fact that my dedication to this website is strong. I lost that dedication when I was told that my time here as been pointless. Though that SM only has 20/20 memory(idiot), he fails to realize that members such as myself have failed to contribute due to lack of respect and complete pointlessness of posting something you worked your ass off on and then either a) get 2 decent posts then the bitching starts or b) you get idiotic posts and questions that have no relevence to the topic you started.

Seeing as I had no intention of ever starting a forum, after being pm'd and messaged by several SENIOR members, I was left with no other decision but to open a forum. Personally, I don't need members from here. You haven't seen me post anything in regards to RX and I have pretty much stated to those members that do come here that to not post links to the site. Whatever happens after that is out of my hands.

To answer that part about "why no links to bombshock?". Well, you know how bots work right. Well, either way it goes, because you know as well as I do that bombshock comes up in discussions on most of these websites that you stated above. So regardless if there is a BIG link that says BOMBSHOCK, the amount of discussion that BS draws on these forums is enough advertisment as it is. Correct?. I can't say that for everyone else but that is how I percieve the situation. And so you know I DID have a link to bombshock till I got my google shit set up. Then I took all the links down. Syncs included.

There is no reason for you to point us out whatsoever. We are just a peon considered to bombshock. Got to start some where though correct. BS didnt have 10 thousand members its first year, though I think its quite funny that you directly pin point us. No I didn't take any members from this website. They came without me speaking a word and thats not just BS but every other site included. What do you think that I'm scared to post a link to bombshock under the intention that it would lead other people here and not to RX? You got that misconstrude to the fullest extent.

You fail to remember your beginning I guess. Would it be fair to say you played off totse just for the simple fact that it was there before BS? or is it just because I'm registered here that you would state something like that? How about you posting a link to totse because most of the people that came here were members there first? O, but we forget little things like that.

To finish it off, like I said, I agree with everything you said. Most of these people need to conjure up a life and get to work on improving it. The bitching on this forum has increased heavily and I will say that I put my input there but only in regards to what I think about your SM. Besides that the bitching & moaning forum is pointless and is only call for more in other areas of the website. If anything bitching and moaning falls under general discussion.

I really have no problem with this website whatsoever and you know this as well as I do, that I don't want to operate a website. I to have a daughter and another business to attend that are more important for the well being of my family. So the added work of maintaining a website is grueling. But I for one believe in good work being rewarded and to simply allow people I have been in contact with on this website for nearly a decade talk about how they got this info and that info but don't want to post it on here for the simple fact that it is pointless in terms of reviews, I was left with no other option but to open RX. The original intention was for the website to be strictly tutorials but after a strong registration of qualified members and them wanting it to be more fringe I had to move it in that direction.

Look, straight up X. I got a lot of respect for you and where I'm from respect goes a long way. If you feel I disrespected you by not putting a link to the site then I will right that wrong simply(even though we haven't talked or battled in a couple years) because I see you as a friend and not a competitor. Just headcase was a horrible, horrible replacement for people like Mush, Low and Paladin.

To add because I let this slip my mind. What the fuck does my grow guide have to do with anything? What, are you assuming that my knowledge on growing marijuana spurred from bombshock? I guess you assisted in the 27 journels I have that document everyone of my grow seasons. Majority of the information in that guide is straight personal experience so to even bring my guide up is a shallow attempt at humor, if that. To even make the accusation that my guide some how spawned off of bombshock is ridiculous. So now all fringe work is property of bombshock now? Man, that right there is the shit that pisses people off. If 3/4ths of these members had my knowledge on drugs there would be no drug forum. That is without the assistance of google or erowid. While I was dealing(and go ahead and take a stab at that one and I will personally show you my criminal record on the dade county sheriffs office), growing, and all the other illegal shit I was wrapped up in, you were building bombs and such.
So taking a stab at my work, when you have no expertise in the field whatsoever is like me taking a stab at an explosives guide you may have written. Pointless.


Also, please explain this

Originally Posted by Xpolsiv

The level to which you are incriminating yourselves is at the least nerve-racking.

[xpl0siv]

Macaveli, You've read into my post entirely against the spirit it was written.

The point I make is that there seems to be a number of branches that aren't crediting their roots. Bombshock was started independently of any other website - namely totse, which you mentioned.

If you choose to read into my post about your guides as saying what you perceived i said then god help you. I can see another cesspool of bitching being born. I suggest you go back and read my post again.

And for the record - i don't actually KNOW where bombshock members came from. I do know that i've never been a member of totse, or any other forum for that matter. It wasnt a critisim, it was a point. Seems your heckles are to easily raised Macaveli.

Xpl0siv

[xpl0siv]

Originally Posted by headcase

Like I said before, Bombshock's high page rank and accessibility is a blessing and a curse. It maintains the member turnover necessary to stop the forums stagnating but makes idiotic questions and stupid discussion almost inevitable. Remember, we're the number one hit on Google if you search for "homemade bombs".

That said, you seem to take an undeservedly bleak view. While I'm not sure what "new direction" you had in mind, the Philosophy section is thriving and the Politics section has it's moments (look at sacrenines or CyberWar). FerretBone can answer pretty much anything in the Weapons section and X-Ray Cat is holding the Explosives section together. We seem to have taken a mantle on Fake ID discussion and Beyond has a number of lockpicking qualifications. And that's to name just a few. There are a lot of fools too but there's also a huge middle-ground. Dozens of young people with a brain and a willingness to learn, if not the polished rhetoric of the elders. We all have a rose-tinted view of the past and I'm as guilty of succumbing to nostalgia as much as anyone but the assumption that it was great then and is shit now I believe is completely groundless. There's just more shit on the internet in general.

__

As regards the Bitching section, I think the whole thing was a mistake and I'd delete it now if I could. No good can or will ever come from it. Hint hint.

__

We also discussed appointing some new moderators to the Fringe sections to maintain a standard there that neither Random nor I can because we don't have the specialist knowledge. We had written up a shortlist but the situation has changed since then. I'll bring it up with Random again but there's a thread in the mod section with most of the information.

Headcase, like i said... 20%. I agree with you completely. I thoroughly enjoy reading through the forums higher quality postings as do many. Thanks!

[Macaveli]

Nah buddy, it's not like that at all. I read your post and understand it completely. I was just pointing out certain material, that's it. Not trying to start an arguement. I guess it appeared that way.

I understand the roots thing you mentioned. Like I said in my post, if you feel that the bots are not enough then I will link the site.

About the grow guide. How would you percieve the situation if I mentioned something you've worked on as if it was basically garbage?

[xpl0siv]

Originally Posted by Macaveli

Nah buddy, it's not like that at all. I read your post and understand it completely. I was just pointing out certain material, that's it. Not trying to start an arguement. I guess it appeared that way.

I understand the roots thing you mentioned. Like I said in my post, if you feel that the bots are not enough then I will link the site.

About the grow guide. How would you percieve the situation if I mentioned something you've worked on as if it was basically garbage?

"I've noticed a few older regulars have formed together to start another spin-off. The level to which you are incriminating yourselves is at the least nerve-racking. Remember shadowcrew? a carding forum is not a good start. Mac's Comprehensive '09 Outdoor Grow Guide Coming January 2009? I truely must be getting old."

Macaveli, Its out of genuine concern that I wrote this. I'm not questioning the quality of your guide. My concern spawns from the level of self-incrimination throughout a number of your posts combined with the seeming naivety of your character. The keyboard an screen are not shields against arrest. Again, don't be so quick to get your heckles up.

Xpl0siv

[Bahr]

Well X. Seeing as I have a link to RX on your site, I will be happy to put a link to BS on my sig on RX. And to be honest I think your a straight up awsome guy(even though you never answer pm's).
I learned a lot of shit from my short time on this website, glad you made it.

And I like the General Random Thread.

[Beyond]

Do you remember a conversation I had with you, Xplosiv, in September of 2006? We had been exchanging emails back in forth in regards to my offer to buy Bombshock. You repeatedly questioned my motives, especially after I revealed that I did not want to monetize the forum and/or website in any form. I told you the reason I made the offer to buy the website was because one of the best memories I had as a teen growing up was visiting this forum and learning from the words and wisdom of guys and girls who knew their stuff in their respective areas. I told you I wanted to bring that back and hopefully produce the same results.

I told you I wanted to bring Bombshock back to that status, not the one you viciously raped with your attempts to "cash in" and monetize a product that could be found on numerous other websites.

I recall sound advice you gave to me many years ago: "If you don't like what you see here, make your own website". Well, I picked and chose my spots and when the cards we're aligned just right, I made that move and I made that website. I'm flattered you've taken notice and felt the need to group us in with those "hoards of idiots...".

"Pity is for the living, envy is for the dead."

-Mark Twain

[Bahr]

Oh yeah. Just to mention, im completly neutral. I lean towards RX but I started at bombshock so I have no complaints.

[bloodlusta]

BS has more threads and people but RX has better information. I moved to RX when I got sick of threads being killed off after a few posts and the lack of real information.

[xpl0siv]

Originally Posted by Beyond

Do you remember a conversation I had with you, Xplosiv, in September of 2006? We had been exchanging emails back in forth in regards to my offer to buy Bombshock. You repeatedly questioned my motives, especially after I revealed that I did not want to monetize the forum and/or website in any form. I told you the reason I made the offer to buy the website was because one of the best memories I had as a teen growing up was visiting this forum and learning from the words and wisdom of guys and girls who knew their stuff in their respective areas. I told you I wanted to bring that back and hopefully produce the same results.

I told you I wanted to bring Bombshock back to that status, not the one you viciously raped with your attempts to "cash in" and monetize a product that could be found on numerous other websites.

I recall sound advice you gave to me many years ago: "If you don't like what you see here, make your own website". Well, I picked and chose my spots and when the cards we're aligned just right, I made that move and I made that website. I'm flattered you've taken notice and felt the need to group us in with those "hoards of idiots...".

"Pity is for the living, envy is for the dead."

-Mark Twain

Unlike many others here Beyond, you won't be able to rope me into one of your pointless back-to-back tit-for-tat arguments.

No, i wasn't willing to pursue some sort of deal with you because i didn't beleive your proposal to be genuine. My loss or yours...? I'm over it.... period.

Your unsubstanciated accusations are a direct reflection of your unwillingness or inability to engage in outside activities! There is more to life Beyond discussion forums..!

[Macaveli]

Originally Posted by xpl0siv

"I've noticed a few older regulars have formed together to start another spin-off. The level to which you are incriminating yourselves is at the least nerve-racking. Remember shadowcrew? a carding forum is not a good start. Mac's Comprehensive '09 Outdoor Grow Guide Coming January 2009? I truely must be getting old."

Macaveli, Its out of genuine concern that I wrote this. I'm not questioning the quality of your guide. My concern spawns from the level of self-incrimination throughout a number of your posts combined with the seeming naivety of your character. The keyboard an screen are not shields against arrest. Again, don't be so quick to get your heckles up.

Xpl0siv

Ok, yes I understand a lot of things I do say on here and other places are self-incriminating. I also have been charged and convicted of everything that I have mentioned, so therefore anything that I do say will not be brought up against me due to our Double Jep. law.

I'm not a complete idiot

[xpl0siv]

Originally Posted by Macaveli

Ok, yes I understand a lot of things I do say on here and other places are self-incriminating. I also have been charged and convicted of everything that I have mentioned, so therefore anything that I do say will not be brought up against me due to our Double Jep. law.

I'm not a complete idiot

Glad to hear you have it all sorted.

Xpl0siv

[Shalshaska]

Too bad to hear about em, even though most were dumbass kids, most mature people would have moved on to RS, SM or BS. But even so, totse did represent a part of me that doesn't see why some people are SOOOOOO uptight about explosives. Some people got lab equipment and a still capable of making nitric themselves, some don't. So some people make fun explosives like AP putty. I think people should be a lot more open to the magic of explosives, but put stress factors on things like >5g AP charges.

[S7@1T3D]

Talking of links, when will signature links be back up?

[Snoopy]

Hi xplosiv.

For all your efforts, you never were an intelligent person. I congratulate you. You just managed to draw some attention to yourself from a rather big, big crowed. Maybe you get off on that? Like a little bitch, flapping her jaw about shit she knows nothing about. Just begging to get back handed...

Oh well. Another notch on our gun belt.

And I can't believe you idiots are still stuck in the "underground" "information" and "fringe" phase. It's not the 80s anymore, limpdicks. The Xfiles haven't aired in what? 8 years now. Get over it. That's why you never got any members. Unlike totse, who had tens of thousands active ones on any give time. And now, they're out there, on the Interweb. Looking for the shit.

Bye xplosiv. That was almost a pun.

[uchiacon]

Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah *fap* *fap* Blah *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap* *fap*
Blah.

There was no real need for anybody to contribute anything to this thread, stop cutting yourselves over the time you have wasted here and go do something. I, for one, am working on a design for a visco fuse machine while I wait for my 10kg of pentaerythritol to arrive in the mail so I can treat it with my 25L 70% or 500mls 95% nitric into a workable explosive. From there I plan to mix it with the RDX I have lying around to form semtex, one of our tightest buddies.

What I'm trying to say here, is get you shit together and stop crying.
If you want a serious forum go to sciencemadness.