easiest acquired gun????

[FerretBone]

Originally Posted by shetlan

You havn't done alot of this have you? What makes buying from a drug dealer any different? If he sells you a bad product, take it back and tell him so. Most drug dealers may be scum, but they have a highly developed sense of customer satisfaction.
Beyond that, ever heard of cleaning the gun? Take it apart, make sure everything's there, everything's oiled, and everything's in decent condition - which you need to do with store bought guns anyway.
If by "private seller" you mean a store (which I assume from the 'receipts and return policy' thing) here's why: Store:
Go to the store, tell them you want to buy a certain gun, fill out the papers, wait ten days, pay $300.

Drug Dealer:
Find the guy (shouldn't take more than a day), see what he's got, pay $100-$200.

With a store, you have government regulation, a paper trail, your face on security cams, and a waiting period. The overall question comes down to whether or not you're going to use teh gun.

You didn't think I was serious about the 'receipts and return policy' statement did you? Jesus Christ I drop my guard for one second and make an attempt at a joke and some fool tries to school me on a bunch of bullshit.


I’ve been in this business longer than you’ve pretended to. Don’t play internet smart guy with me Jack. I’ve already picked up on all your little tell signs that suggest your full of shit dude. Before you reply to me with anymore of your firearm theories. Do a little more research, then think long and hard before you go down that road with me.

1st, if you do not know common terms like “private sells”, than you’d be smart to admit you’ve got a lot to learn.
A private seller always means buying from a private seller. It’s simple. To buy a firearm through the classifieds in a news paper, from non FFLs at gun shows, on and on. Like buying a car from a private seller means just about anything except buying a car from a dealer or manufacturer.

In order not to incriminate your self, or in order to sound legit, instead of stating something stupid like, “you could get a gun from the black market, drug dealers, murders etc. You simply say “you can buy a firearm from a private seller.” It sure sounds legal doesn’t it? Depending on what your intent is, it probably is legal.

2nd, Using the term “gun”. There is nothing wrong with it, but like in every profession, the difference between the amateurs and the professionals is quickly spotted by correctly or incorrectly mislabeling items.
Once again there not a dam thing wrong with calling a firearm a gun. It just means you haven’t been around in this field long enough to pickup on this professional pet peeve .

3rd, “go to the store” Like above, it’s a dealer or FFL.

4th, “fill out the papers” Like above they are not papers they are 4473s. I don’t expect you to know that, but if you have done this before you would have called it by it’s known name. A Yellow Form. And it’ not “papers”, but only one form.

5th, Federally there is no waiting period. That was replaced by the NICS check. Only 13 states have any waiting period. The only state that imposes a “10 day wait” is California.
BWHAHAHAHA! If you happen to be from California, you must be nuts to think you know more about buying firearms than the rest of the pro-gun states.

So the going rate for a firearm on the black market is only $100-200 less than an FFL. Where did you get this price list? Does it rise and fall with the stock market? No need to answer, that’s just my way of saying your full of shit.

[Misanthropy]

Kit guns are very doable & for cheap. Problem being either the upper or lower receivers or the barrel, for any particular model, will always come with a serial number stamped into it. Grinding it out doesn't do much good as they (the feds, when they get wind of a mystery gun) can just acid lift the impressions out due to the ground out stampings having made more dense impressions in the metal than the rest of the structure.

For these pieces you need replacement parts to be hand made/milled, literally and generally at a reduction in accuracy or performance, or you need them made & sent from other countries.

For instance, Bulgaria is home to the world's largest AK-47 manufacturing plant, IIRC. Things are cheap & corrupt over there & it's not too hard to find someone that works there who's open to a bribe when all they make is about $20USD a day. $100/upper receiver (semi, full or SF), sent in pieces, with a $200 AK kit, just made you a finished product worth several grand to the right people.

Acquiring contacts within said plant is your problem & this is no doubt already on big brother's radar so, buyer beware.

Oh, not to mention a fair volume of Bulgaria's postal mail is manually opened & inspected nowadays. Private couriers don't seem to have so much of a problem yet but they maintain the right.... Just FYI.

Oh, another thing @ the OP: Uzi is not cheap, regardless. They are not the Cobray M-11 you likely see & are thinking of Uzi. Uzi is a very well engineered & complex piece of machinery. Cobray sells at a few hundred bucks NEW and is easily modified for full auto by shaving off about 1/8" - 1/4" from the large hammer lobe (sear catch) opposite the axle it rotates on. Do not trim the small lobe, you'll be in for a surprise. Do not cut or change any of the springs.

[Misanthropy]

Originally Posted by mopars69

what is the easiest gun to get,and i mean unregistered.my opinions are
1.ak-47
2. 12 gauge shotgun
3.uzi's
4. tec-nines
these are the easiest because almost everyone i know has one for sale.these unregistered weapons are usually cheap.

Also, I'd like to note that these are "unregistered" because they're semi auto and thusly, not subject to class 3 weapons registration nor required to be transferred (in my state anyway) under private sales.

[bloodlusta]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

Also, I'd like to note that these are "unregistered" because they're semi auto and thusly, not subject to class 3 weapons registration nor required to be transferred (in my state anyway) under private sales.

Ok im confused. Does that mean you are mopars69? Who was banned? And who posted on similer threads to you? And in the same way as you? hmmmmmmm

[shetlan]

Originally Posted by bloodlusta

Ok im confused. Does that mean you are mopars69? Who was banned? And who posted on similer threads to you? And in the same way as you? hmmmmmmm

Ooooh, tipped his hat there didn't he.

[FerretBone]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

"Also, I'd like to note that these are "unregistered" because they're semi auto and thusly, not subject to class 3 weapons registration nor required to be transferred (in my state anyway) under private sales.

BWHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!........... .............OK now I am laughing at you. That was dumb, are you aware of that?

I'd also like to note, no they are not "unregistered" simi auto firearms.
They were all registered by the Manufacturer or the importer. Then registered buy the dealer (FFL) when they received the firearms at their retail store. Then basically registered again with the NICS check at the time of sale to the public, then registered again in the FFLs bound book with the end buyers name. And the bound book stays with the FFL the entire life of his business.

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

"Cobray sells at a few hundred bucks NEW and is easily modified for full auto by shaving off about 1/8" - 1/4" from the large hammer lobe (sear catch) opposite the axle it rotates on. Do not trim the small lobe, you'll be in for a surprise. Do not cut or change any of the springs

With this advise, you’ll be in for a “surprise” either way. I’m guessing you think that you would have a run away uzi if you mill the “ small lobe”.

No you will not.
And no you will not have a full auto uzi if you “shave if 1/8 of metal from the sear” of a simi auto. You would have a trigger hammer that follows the bolt until the bolt closes against the chamber. The hammer would never have enough force on the firing pin to set the primer off. What will happen is, the hammer would hit the back of the bolt, push the firing pin forward, before the bolt pushes a round out of the mag.
On a rare occasion it may fire the round, but long before it bolt is closed. (Firing out of battery.)

Here is why.
1. The full auto uzi fires from an open bolt.
2. The bolt its self has a fixed firing pin. It does not move.



1. Simi auto uzis fires from a closed bolt.

2. It uses a striker pin. Like an M-16. So the simi auto bolt is hollow in the center and the firing pin floats/moves through the tube like bolt. Also

3. The simi auto uzi receiver has a large metal piece wielded on the right side in the rear. It’s in the way if you try to use a full auto bolt in a simi auto uzi. Its called a blocking rail, or blocking bar. A simi auto bolt has a grove cut into it on the right side to allow the bolt to pass over and through the blocking rail.

4. The simi auto uzi has what’s called a restrictor ring in front of the chamber, where the round goes to be fired. So if you take a full auto bolt, and remove the blocking bar, it would slam the bolts face into the restrictor ring. The full auto bolts face would need to be milled down. Or the restrictor ring would need to be milled out. Allowing the bolt to close completely to fire any rounds.

It’s illegal to

A. Modifying a full auto uzi bolt to fit into any Simi auto uzi is considered by the ATF manufacturing a machinegun. Even if you do not own a simi auto uzi.
B. An simi auto uzi receiver can not be modified to accept a full auto bolt. That’s manufacturing a machinegun. Again even if you do not own a full auto bolt.

There is no reason for me to continue, I cant legally make it much clearer than that. The above is four reasons why your "quality of information," and your "posts that speak for themselves" with your "background & knowledge say all it needs to be said" is more than likely complete runny clown shit.

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

"C'mon. Get up off your thumbs, out of your computer chairs & give me something real. Not some opinionated, predigested information from the web, faggots"


"Wait, wait. Lemme get this right. None of you people have any insight at all on this thing?

Shetlan?

Ferretbone?

Would you like me to give you any more "insight" ?

[Misanthropy]

Fist off, it's "SEMI" not "SIMI"...

Secondly, by "registered" I meant registered as a class 3 weapon, not that they are manufactured off the books, idiot.

Third, I never said anything about modifying an Uzi; only the Cobray. The two of which are designed in completely different ways & never did I say anything about modifying the hammer of an Uzi...

Fourth, I've modified the Cobray in the past to function in full auto operation. Care to try it yourself before you speak?

Perhaps you'd like to take a look at this?



Here are the complete full auto modification guides for each if you like...

Cobray PM-11 Full Auto
MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service

Uzi, Legally Converting the Uzi to Full Automatic - William Bishop.pdf
MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service

Uzi Full-Auto Receiver
MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service

Excuse me guys... Were you saying something????

Originally Posted by FerretBone

BWHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!........... .............OK now I am laughing at you. That was dumb, are you aware of that?

I'd also like to note, no they are not "unregistered" simi auto firearms.
They were all registered by the Manufacturer or the importer. Then registered buy the dealer (FFL) when they received the firearms at their retail store. Then basically registered again with the NICS check at the time of sale to the public, then registered again in the FFLs bound book with the end buyers name. And the bound book stays with the FFL the entire life of his business.

With this advise, you’ll be in for a “surprise” either way. I’m guessing you think that you would have a run away uzi if you mill the “ small lobe”.

No you will not.
And no you will not have a full auto uzi if you “shave if 1/8 of metal from the sear” of a simi auto. You would have a trigger hammer that follows the bolt until the bolt closes against the chamber. The hammer would never have enough force on the firing pin to set the primer off. What will happen is, the hammer would hit the back of the bolt, push the firing pin forward, before the bolt pushes a round out of the mag.
On a rare occasion it may fire the round, but long before it bolt is closed. (Firing out of battery.)

Here is why.
1. The full auto uzi fires from an open bolt.
2. The bolt its self has a fixed firing pin. It does not move.

1. Simi auto uzis fires from a closed bolt.

2. It uses a striker pin. Like an M-16. So the simi auto bolt is hollow in the center and the firing pin floats/moves through the tube like bolt. Also

3. The simi auto uzi receiver has a large metal piece wielded on the right side in the rear. It’s in the way if you try to use a full auto bolt in a simi auto uzi. Its called a blocking rail, or blocking bar. A simi auto bolt has a grove cut into it on the right side to allow the bolt to pass over and through the blocking rail.

4. The simi auto uzi has what’s called a restrictor ring in front of the chamber, where the round goes to be fired. So if you take a full auto bolt, and remove the blocking bar, it would slam the bolts face into the restrictor ring. The full auto bolts face would need to be milled down. Or the restrictor ring would need to be milled out. Allowing the bolt to close completely to fire any rounds.

It’s illegal to

A. Modifying a full auto uzi bolt to fit into any Simi auto uzi is considered by the ATF manufacturing a machinegun. Even if you do not own a simi auto uzi.
B. An simi auto uzi receiver can not be modified to accept a full auto bolt. That’s manufacturing a machinegun. Again even if you do not own a full auto bolt.

There is no reason for me to continue, I cant legally make it much clearer than that. The above is four reasons why your "quality of information," and your "posts that speak for themselves" with your "background & knowledge say all it needs to be said" is more than likely complete runny clown shit.

Would you like me to give you any more "insight" ?

Originally Posted by bloodlusta

The reason why ferret is one of the most respected members of Bomeshock and Misanthropy is not

+ rep

Damn, neither one of you can spell correctly to save your lives...

BTW: You're off topic.

[FerretBone]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

Fist off, it's "SEMI" not "SIMI"...

Secondly, by "registered" I meant registered as a class 3 weapon, not that they are manufactured off the books, idiot.

Third, I never said anything about modifying an Uzi; only the Cobray. The two of which are designed in completely different ways & never did I say anything about modifying the hammer of an Uzi...

You want to play dirty? OK, Lets play dirty


“class three”. WTF is a class three? Because it sure as hell is not a firearm. And no it isn’t even a full auto firearm. “Class three“, is a firearms dealer who sells full autos, suppressors, SBR’s, SBS’s, and D&D’s.
Class 3, not “class three” is not the weapons category covering the above. The firearms category name is called an NFA. The term NFA covers all the above in that category, not class 3. And defiantly not “class three”


SO, excuse me if I believed you were talking about an Uzi instead of Cobrays. About half way into your first sentence you quit making any sense. I was trying to decipher all the random thoughts and incorrect names used, that you were spewing out of your tiny head. Sorry, I can’t get it right every time.

So yes, with oversights like that I assumed you were dumb enough to think UZI’s were made by Cobray.
BTW, Those last two links you wasted my time with, were how to convert a simi Uzi to look and function identically to an IMI Uzi. 98% of that was comedic. The other 2% was changing the barrel, and then acquiring a registered bolt, which know one here besides me would or could do.
Actually I can’t acquiring a registered bolt as well. Because that write up was done in the 80s. And it’s almost impossible these days to find a registered bolt for a Uzi for sale. Without the Uzi. And if you have a full auto Uzi already, then you don’t need to build a full auto uzi from a simi auto(host gun) uzi…… Make sense?


But if you did you would need to
A. mill out the rings.
Or
B. mill out the bolt face. Funny I remember saying something like that in my last post. Crazy one of us “kids” here know what they are talking about uh?

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

Fourth, I've modified the Cobray in the past to function in full auto operation. Care to try it yourself before you speak?

Yet again the extent you will go (regardless of the brainless the self incrimination) to prove how intelligent you think you are to a guy on the internet. First let me ask you how much did you pay for the host gun? ….. That’s the original SIMI auto Mac you claimed to have mod’ed.



Now about your attempt to lure me to the electronics threads to show me how smart you are.
BWHAAAAAAAAAAAA
Wow I didn’t see that coming a mile away. In fact it was pretty sad on your part. To try to win arguments with me by saying “Uh yeah, then how do you make a wireless transmitter?”
I told you I know dick about it. Or electronics for that matter. Infact I believe that was my first and only post in those threads. Why because I keep my fucking mouth shut when I don’t know what I’m talking about. All I wanted to do was annoy you about your nerdy diagram. Looks like I did.

Do you want to know how I figured out you had an unconnected pin? Because your shitty diagram says it you fucking idiot. BWHAAA!!!! That it, that’s were I got that from.
Did you think, I thought, I’d cornered you by finding errors with your project? HA, the jokes on you fool. I was mocking you!

But I do have one question about you kindergarten project. How do you expect me to believe you can get a 1 mile range on a project you have not finished yet? The reason why I ask is the ambitor radio we used in Iraq were supposed to have a two mile range. On a perfect day and on flat terrain we maybe would get 1 mile. If the US Gov’t can hardly get 1 mile off our ambitors, then I think you’re a damn fool for claiming you will get 1 mile of a transmitter the size of a cell phone.

Your either on the brink of discovering space age technology, or you’re an idiot. Guess which one I think you are.

So now will you stop private messaging me with your kindergarten taunts? Be cause I really don’t have the time to please you anymore kitty cat.
And yes I did talk shit about you to Sheltan in a private message. Right after you messaged me with the tile fagotbone asking me to please help you figure out that waste of time transmitter project. Your right though. From now on I should post thoughts about you in public.

Here is a thought. Headcase, brother, you no better than I do, it’s time to ban this childest idiot. I’ve been told we have to many little kids spewing out misinformation here. Well Headcase, I think we both know where to start.

Public enough for you Miss Anthropy?

[Misanthropy]

Originally Posted by FerretBone

You want to play dirty? OK, Lets play dirty

“class three”. WTF is a class three? Because it sure as hell is not a firearm. And no it isn’t even a full auto firearm. “Class three“, is a firearms dealer who sells full autos, suppressors, SBR’s, SBS’s, and D&D’s.
Class 3, not “class three” is not the weapons category covering the above. The firearms category name is called an NFA. The term NFA covers all the above in that category, not class 3. And defiantly not “class three”

Class III covers the business type & weapons type.

Class III Weapon Sales
Class III Weapon Sales

Western Firearms Company (WFC) is a Texas-based Class 3 business located just north of the Dallas/Fort Worth airport. Not only have we been dealing in machine guns for 24 years, but our association with the weapons business in general stretches back to 1971. As specialists in Class 3 weapons and military weapons of all types, WFC boasts one of the largest inventories of collector-grade arms in the state of Texas.

In 1986, the United States government banned the future importation and domestic manufacture of machine guns for civilian consumption, and the already limited inventory of Class 3 weapons has since diminished substantially. At a rate now more accelerated than ever, these weapons are ending up in the hands of collectors who have no intention of ever selling them. The effect is twofold: Class 3 arms are growing increasingly scarce, and their prices are rising accordingly. Further Federal bans in 1989 and 1994 relating to semiautomatic clones of military weapons have spurred similar trends in that arena as well. Thus, the price of a quality, collector-grade Class 3 or semiautomatic weapon has spiraled beyond the comprehension of the average buyer.

We have found, though, that high-end collectors' appetites for the best are rarely fulfilled, and it is to them that we cater. These people are often first-time owners whose efforts to find and acquire a particular arm of choice have been frustrated by their inability to locate that weapon or by a lack of information on what is involved in a legally- conducted Class 3 transfer. The images that you are viewing on the Web pages are photographs of the actual weapons, not representative examples. These will include right, left and detailed views in most cases. If you see something that interests you, please call us. WFC excels at finding whatever we do not already have, and we can make it yours "right and proper".

Originally Posted by FerretBone

SO, excuse me if I believed you were talking about an Uzi instead of Cobrays. About half way into your first sentence you quit making any sense. I was trying to decipher all the random thoughts and incorrect names used, that you were spewing out of your tiny head. Sorry, I can’t get it right every time.

So yes, with oversights like that I assumed you were dumb enough to think UZI’s were made by Cobray.
BTW, Those last two links you wasted my time with, were how to convert a simi Uzi to look and function identically to an IMI Uzi. 98% of that was comedic. The other 2% was changing the barrel, and then acquiring a registered bolt, which know one here besides me would or could do.

Yep, you fucked up. Not my fault you can't comprehend/read/write the English language properly. Your posts speak for themselves on that count bro.

Originally Posted by FerretBone

BTW, Those last two links you wasted my time with, were how to convert a simi Uzi to look and function identically to an IMI Uzi. 98% of that was comedic. The other 2% was changing the barrel, and then acquiring a registered bolt, which know one here besides me would or could do.
Actually I can’t acquiring a registered bolt as well. Because that write up was done in the 80s. And it’s almost impossible these days to find a registered bolt for a Uzi for sale. Without the Uzi. And if you have a full auto Uzi already, then you don’t need to build a full auto uzi from a simi auto(host gun) uzi…… Make sense?

But if you did you would need to
A. mill out the rings.
Or
B. mill out the bolt face. Funny I remember saying something like that in my last post. Crazy one of us “kids” here know what they are talking about uh?

Again with the emphasis on Uzi.... I wasn't at any point discussing them. You were. I provided that material only for anyone who might want it, not as a point of discussion, asshat. You're not doing yourself any favors by trying to change the subject. Ok?

Originally Posted by FerretBone

Yet again the extent you will go (regardless of the brainless the self incrimination) to prove how intelligent you think you are to a guy on the internet. First let me ask you how much did you pay for the host gun? ….. That’s the original SIMI auto Mac you claimed to have mod’ed.

"Simi" isn't a real word, dumb ass. And a Cobray is NOT a MAC. MAC = Military Armament Corp. The company that Ingram was divested to. Then came a husband & wife company, SWC, which was followed by Cobray. Cobray & Ingram/MAC guns are COMPLETELY different in design, dipshit. And not that it's any of your business, but a SEMI AUTO COBRAY PM-11 only costs about $350. That's what I modded & that's what that illustration covers, jackass. Which, again, is obvious if you have any kind of grasp of the English language.

Self incrimination? That was done well in the past with no evidence to prove it so, kindly, shut the fuck up. I'm not proving how smart I am, but rather how ignorant you are. See the following post of yours for more evidence...

Originally Posted by FerretBone

Now about your attempt to lure me to the electronics threads to show me how smart you are.
BWHAAAAAAAAAAAA
Wow I didn’t see that coming a mile away. In fact it was pretty sad on your part. To try to win arguments with me by saying “Uh yeah, then how do you make a wireless transmitter?”
I told you I know dick about it. Or electronics for that matter. Infact I believe that was my first and only post in those threads. Why because I keep my fucking mouth shut when I don’t know what I’m talking about. All I wanted to do was annoy you about your nerdy diagram. Looks like I did.

Do you want to know how I figured out you had an unconnected pin? Because your shitty diagram says it you fucking idiot. BWHAAA!!!! That it, that’s were I got that from.
Did you think, I thought, I’d cornered you by finding errors with your project? HA, the jokes on you fool. I was mocking you!

Wow man. You didn't keep your mouth shut though & I quoted you in the thread just to prove it. "Up your modulation". ?????

Hey, at least you're finally admitting you're making mistakes.

1: Not understanding my plain English in this gun thread and
2: Not knowing dick about electronics when you yet go on to wiki something you don't know dick about & speak as if you do...

You're on a roll, keep admitting when you're wrong & we'll get along just fine... So long as you use spell check...

You didn't annoy me, you entertained me. I personally find it rather fun to mirror your ignorance against you when you continue to flap your gums.

Unconnected pin: Yes, I know quite well you read that on the test simulation page.... otherwise you wouldn't have known to say so. Yet the fact that you cite this fact when you could have so easily have googled or wiki'd a 741 op amp instead of randomly flapping your gums shows again how driven you are to display your ignorance.

Furthermore your "Bwuahahahaha" stuff just shows you for the child you really are, resorting to 3rd grade diversionary tactics to try to draw attention off of your ignorant posts... Sorry pal, it's not working. You'd do best just to shut the fuck up when you know you're beat, rather than stating the obvious over & over.

[Misanthropy]

MODS: Double post due to too many characters... Continued here...

Originally Posted by FerretBone

But I do have one question about you kindergarten project. How do you expect me to believe you can get a 1 mile range on a project you have not finished yet? The reason why I ask is the ambitor radio we used in Iraq were supposed to have a two mile range. On a perfect day and on flat terrain we maybe would get 1 mile. If the US Gov’t can hardly get 1 mile off our ambitors, then I think you’re a damn fool for claiming you will get 1 mile of a transmitter the size of a cell phone. Your either on the brink of discovering space age technology, or you’re an idiot. Guess which one I think you are.

Well, it's actually smaller than the surface area of a 5 stick pack of gum. Yes, 1mile range is easily doable & not only is this easy to do but I think you're talking shit about even being in Irag & you don't know shit about military RF technology.... No, you don't.. You know why?

DealExtreme: $27.89 UCOM 8-KM/5-Mile Walkie Talkie (2-Pack)
"UCOM 8-KM/5-Mile Walkie Talkie (2-Pack)

Price: $27.89"


THAT is the size of a cell phone & gets actual 5 miles range. So now what?

Originally Posted by FerretBone

So now will you stop private messaging me with your kindergarten taunts? Be cause I really don’t have the time to please you anymore kitty cat.

Can't stand the heat, pussy?

Originally Posted by FerretBone

And yes I did talk shit about you to Sheltan in a private message. Right after you messaged me with the tile fagotbone asking me to please help you figure out that waste of time transmitter project. Your right though. From now on I should post thoughts about you in public.

Here is a thought. Headcase, brother, you no better than I do, it’s time to ban this childest idiot. I’ve been told we have to many little kids spewing out misinformation here. Well Headcase, I think we both know where to start.

Public enough for you Miss Anthropy?

Guess not! lol

"Childest"? WTF?

Awww, calling on your friends to fight your battles for you, by banning me, just like your little butt buddy Shetlan? How cute!

Misinformation? You have yet to prove me wrong on any point whatsoever & I only keep presenting you with factual information supporting my statements & debasing yours. Why can't you simply reciprocate?

Oh, and it's not "Miss Anthropy" or "Miss" anything. Again, let me just correct you with your very best friend, wikipedia:

Misanthropy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

People like you are the reason people like me choose names like Misanthropy...

Got it?

[FerretBone]

Bubbles, I really do not know what made you this stupid, but it really fucking worked.


Gordon Ingrams company in Powder springs was the designer of the Military Armament Corporation, and all models of machineguns from Ingram 6 thorough Ingram 10………. Military Armament Corporation’s model 10. The mac-10
This is important so lesson up, MAC went under in the 70s and Ingram sold the rights for Mac-10 and Mac-11 to RPB Industries. Then SMG’s based on Ingram’s designs, were copied by other companies like SWD Inc, and You guessed it,……..Coooooobray.

I'll leave you with this one last thought, even tho you’ve got nowhere to put it!
Cobray is a trademark. There was never any Cobray made firearms. Long after Ingram sank, and after many other companies got the rights, Cobray put their name on Ingrams Macs, RPBs MACs, and Texas MACs.

Strike one cupcake………………………………................

Call it what you want to but, It’s a MAC sweetie, they are all MAC’s. No they do not function completely different. They function the same. Because they are COPIES.
MAC copies. Just like the AK-47. China, Russia, Egypt, etc etc etc. It’s still called an AK-47. MAC’s are called MAC’s for that reason. OK RPB’s receivers were a little bit longer. And some have very small cosmetic changes, but function the same. And are called MAC's.


Western Firearms??????? Oh my God, you would copy and paste that crooks web site. Did you know he operates out of a storage lot? No retail store, no showroom, just a website. Believe it or not, I have talked to that idiot many times. He caters to the rich and un-informed. Must be how you linked up with him. He capitalizes on people’s fears, myths, and lack of knowledge. He dumbs the lingo and terms down for the uneducated. Like calling automatic firearms “class three.” I can give you references and phone numbers to many Class 3 dealers in the DFW area who say please avoid that man. He is the used car sales man of NFA’s in Dallas.
Did you know he gets all his firearms from Subguns? He buys Macs for 2,900 then sells them for close to 5,000. WTF does a person need him for? You can buy from subguns too. You need him if you are a retard and don’t know enough about NFA’s to go straight to the source. LIKE YOU


Next time you try to corner me with a source from the web, don’t use a man I’ve talked to numerous times honey buns. BTW Did you know I live in Dallas? Please tell me you didn’t know that? Don’t tell me you are that fucking stupid. Thinking I wouldn’t know, or know of most FFL’s and Class 3 dealers in this area. Because this is what I do.
Wow look how scared you are. On the net, minute after minute, hour after hour, desperately trying to prove me wrong. And that’s the best you’ve come up with, Western Firearms……………………BWHAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!! Do you have a intolerably empty feeling in your head now?

“Class III covers the business type” Period. Not the weapon type. Weapons type is NFA.

http://www.subguns.com/classifieds/ Subguns, The biggest website for NFA’s Look at the front page ads, does it say class three?

NFA Market Board - Message Index The second biggest NFA board. Does it say class three firearms sections? No

These are the two main places where all the Class 3 dealers go to trade NFAs. These two boards also are where the price of the market come from. If you wanted to buy my MAC, I would sell it for at least what it takes for me to replace it. This is where I go to find that price. And where I go to replace it. Go ahead, tell me everything else you think you know. I have time, because it will only take 20 or 30 more seconds.


Strike two sweetie………………………………..............


“I wasn't at any point discussing them”

Nope you brought it up in your first sentence you blubbered out, then said “uzi’s are not like Cobray,” then jumped back to uzi’s, how “state of the art they are,” then blubbered again about Cobray. See how confusing that might sound? Holly mother of God who keeps letting you on the internet.


“SEMI AUTO COBRAY PM-11 only costs about $350”

You mean SWD. If its open bolt it was manufactured by SWD. Cobray put their name on it. If it’s close bolt, then you didn’t mod shit, not that I think you did. Your either a liar, or wrong yet again. Keep on posting, one of these days you might say something intelligent.

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

Well, it's actually smaller than the surface area of a 5 stick pack of gum. Yes, 1mile range is easily doable & not only is this easy to do but I think you're talking shit about even being in Irag & you don't know shit about military RF technology.... No, you don't.. You know why?

Do you know what’s funny? I’m making an idiot out of you, but honestly, with the shit you post, I really can’t take any of the credit for it.


Now about this radio shit you posted. The very first two posts from people who used these.
Cons: “I got the 5km version ones, but this version isn't really 5km, I tested it, and it is like 1,5km.”

Next guy says
“Range seems to be ok up to around 500m or so”

From the very website you linked me to. Plus they are not secure, so the military does not use little toys like these. Sweetie you were born on the highway where all the other accidences happened. So your one link was to a radio much better than yours with shitty range. My question still stands. I'll pretend to care how you think your getting 1 mile range from that peice of shit you can't even finish building.

Strike three sweetie………………………………............


Your right its really low of me to continue laughing at a special needs child like you. OK I’ll stop. From now on I’ll just sit back and laugh at your impotence quietly with the rest of us.

So your Miss Anthropy and don’t like people. I wouldn’t like my little world either if I were you. Frankly, you hate your self not others. Tell your baby sitter to turn the computer off for you, so you can pretend to have to still have some self dignity.





BTW I have not talked to Headcase in years. For really dumb reasons, no we have not been friends. He is very good at swaping flies like you. Trust me punk, your clock is ticking here. EDIT( with some folks, things never change. )So yeah set your watch, you'll be gone soon. By bye sweetie.

[FerretBone]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

Well, it's actually smaller than the surface area of a 5 stick pack of gum. Yes, 1mile range is easily doable & not only is this easy to do but I think you're talking shit about even being in Irag & you don't know shit about military RF technology.... No, you don't.. You know why?


THAT is the size of a cell phone & gets actual 5 miles range. So now what?

Whoops!! forgot to actually read your own link?

So who in the military uses these in Iraq? The answer is no one. They are banned down range for two reasons.
1. The enemy uses them to remote detonate IEDs.
2. They are not encrypted. We are not allowed to use any non encrypted means of communication.

“So now what” Yes ,I was thinking the same thing, So now what was the actual range on those toys you advertised? Fuck what the box says.


https://secure.thalescomminc.com/dat...earMBITR-s.pdf

Here is what we use down range. It’s actual range is about 1 mile on good days. The makers say 2-3 miles. We have never got more than a mile.

But you’re the radio self proclaimed expert. Maybe you can sell your toys that transmit over a mile in range to the Military. After all you’ve got me convinced.

[Misanthropy]

Are you even talking? You keep making noise & saying nothing...

What possesses you?

[FerretBone]

So what the hell does that mean. That your trying to buy time so you can research some more bullshit.
Or did you already do that, find out how dumb your post were.

I'm sorry, I really thought you were being an idiot intentionally. I didn't know it was completely natural. It appears you have begun to realize that.

Well good, because I'm busy drinking at the moment, and calling it a night.

[shetlan]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

Are you even talking? You keep making noise & saying nothing...

What possesses you?

I heard him fine.
1: All MAC-10s work the same way, no matter who's stamp is on them. Saying that it's not a "MAC-10" because it's made by Cobray is like saying it's not an "AR-15" because it's made by Colt.

2: He smoked your transmitter BS.

Also, alot of people referr to Semi-auto's as "simi-autos" - it's a regional thing, much like the phrase "in a go-cup".

To quote Ferret, just because it's fun:
BWHAAAAAAAAAAAA

[ninefingers]

Originally Posted by FerretBone

All firearms that are manufacturerd these days are registered by the manufacturer with the ATF period. Unless you find one that has been passed around to enough people second hand, then a firearm is easy to trace. .
Once again if it was manufactured in the US it has already been registered.
Once at birth

So, does that mean my 1934 Remington .22 was registered, new? What about my 1934 "Diamond Arms" shotgun, which was made for a hardware store in St. Louis, and never had a serial number? I was told by the NRA the shotgun was perfectly legal, as not all smaller mfgrs. in those days serialized their guns.

[shetlan]

Originally Posted by ninefingers

So, does that mean my 1934 Remington .22 was registered, new? What about my 1934 "Diamond Arms" shotgun, which was made for a hardware store in St. Louis, and never had a serial number? I was told by the NRA the shotgun was perfectly legal, as not all smaller mfgrs. in those days serialized their guns.

If your gun was produced prior to the Gun Control Act of 1968, then it shouldn't need a serial number at all.

[ninefingers]

Originally Posted by FerretBone

“what the box says.

Here is what we use down range. It’s actual range is about 1 mile on good days. The makers say 2-3 miles. We have never got more than a mile.

.

I don't get this arguing--my 2M Ham radio , on 2 watts, hits the Mt. Lemmon repeater, about 5 miles away. No obstructions, of course.
When people say of range on a Cell Phone, they forget these are hitting repeaters.--the actual, simplex range (if it were possible) is probably only 1 1/2 miles; the radius of a "cell". And, judging from a 3.7 volt, maybe 2 ampere/hr battery; this makes for about 6 watts, input, max, and it has to run the 'works as well as the transmitter, and still have some reserve for the rest of the day--that makes probably a
1/2-to -1 w output.

Thanks, Shetlan. But most guns I've seen had serial numbers 'way back into the nineteenth century, whether needed or not. My 1897 Winchester model 94 had a very low one--one of the first smokeless powder model 94's.

[shetlan]

Originally Posted by ninefingers

Thanks, Shetlan. But most guns I've seen had serial numbers 'way back into the nineteenth century, whether needed or not. My 1897 Winchester model 94 had a very low one--one of the first smokeless powder model 94's.

Much like registrations for toasters and refrigerators, many companies would have still serial numbered their weapons as a way of enforcing warranties and such - this would have been entirely for internal use or to recall parts if a particular set was faulty. "Registration" of these weapons would have been entirely voluntary.

[Misanthropy]

Originally Posted by shetlan

I heard him fine.
1: All MAC-10s work the same way, no matter who's stamp is on them. Saying that it's not a "MAC-10" because it's made by Cobray is like saying it's not an "AR-15" because it's made by Colt.

2: He smoked your transmitter BS.

Also, alot of people referr to Semi-auto's as "simi-autos" - it's a regional thing, much like the phrase "in a go-cup".

To quote Ferret, just because it's fun:
BWHAAAAAAAAAAAA

1: Cobray doesn't make MACs. They make Cobrays. A completely different design. Go ahead & make the effort to look for yourself. I believe there was even a change in the disconnector of the MAC 10 after 1972 or some such thing. It's in the documentation, read.

2: He hasn't smoked anything but meat & my transmitters work just fine at 3/4 miles & the carrier itself is detectable at closer to a mile. Build one, see for yourself. Then talk shit.

3: The English definition is Semi. We're using the English language as our medium & only a moron would try to defend such asinine misuse of it, not to mention the failure to use spell check on such a consistent basis if one simply cannot spell correctly.

4: Your levels of humor leaves much to be desired, as do your intellects, but this is expected by now.

And you have yet to get anywhere with your stupid mopar reference. You claim to have screenshots. Post them if you have any credibility or I call you for the liar you are.

Liar.

[shetlan]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

1: Cobray doesn't make MACs. They make Cobrays. A completely different design. Go ahead & make the effort to look for yourself. I believe there was even a change in the disconnector of the MAC 10 after 1972 or some such thing. It's in the documentation, read.

MAC, Ingram & Cobray*|*M10*|*e-GunParts.com

The parts for MAC-10, Ingram M-10, and Cobray M-10 are interchangable and identical. The only difference is the brand name.

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

2: He hasn't smoked anything but meat & my transmitters work just fine at 3/4 miles & the carrier itself is detectable at closer to a mile. Build one, see for yourself. Then talk shit.

Wheren't you saying "1 mile easy" - what was it, yesterday?

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

3: The English definition is Semi. We're using the English language as our medium & only a moron would try to defend such asinine misuse of it, not to mention the failure to use spell check on such a consistent basis if one simply cannot spell correctly.

It's a regional phrase Misanthropy. What's your next move? Are you going to try to discredit bloodlusta for calling someone a "wanker" instead of a jackass?

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

4: Your levels of humor leaves much to be desired, as do your intellects, but this is expected by now.

At the great risk of repeating myself yet again - "And yet, you're still here".

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

And you have yet to get anywhere with your stupid mopar reference. You claim to have screenshots. Post them if you have any credibility or I call you for the liar you are.

Liar.

For a guy with no credibility of his own, you make alot of demands.

[headcase]

Drop the childish name-calling people. If someone doesn't provide information challenge them on it. If they're wrong, challenge that. You don't have to be friends, just adults. Or even just over 15.

From here you'll get one warning then a week's ban.

[FerretBone]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

1: Cobray doesn't make MACs. They make Cobrays. A completely different design. Go ahead & make the effort to look for yourself. I believe there was even a change in the disconnector of the MAC 10 after 1972 or some such thing. It's in the documentation, read.

2: He hasn't smoked anything but meat & my transmitters work just fine at 3/4 miles & the carrier itself is detectable at closer to a mile. Build one, see for yourself. Then talk shit

I’ll try it this way. Because I’m really wasting a lot of time with this. M-10 Cobray, Ingram, whatever, it’s a moot point, and irrelevant.

It is common knowledge that Ingram designed and produced the M-10. Period.

Not so common knowledge, INGRAM sold all the rights to RPB Industries. Then RPB sold the rights to a firearm they called MAC to everyone. Under that name RPB, First sold to MAC Stephensville TX (known as a TX MAC, then and now). TX bought the rights and produced that firearm. And they called them MAC’s

At about the same time RPB had sold the rights to TX. The owner of RPB (Wayne Daniel) transferred the licensing rights of Ingrams M-10, to another company him and his wife founded called. SWD (Sylvia and Wayne Daniel), he started a that company under his wifes name. Because of his battle with the ATF about how easy it was to convert the simi auto M-10 pistol to automatic. That he designed, under the company name, RPB.

Quick break down.

M.A.C Ingram invented the M-10 then sold the rights to
RPB. They sold the licensing rights to MAC Stephensville TX. But RPB held the rights.
RPB went under and “sold” the rights to the renamed SWD. And so on and so one.
After TX got the licensing rights, and they sold Ingrams, M-10 as MAC-10, it has been called MAC’s ever since. Because it was Ingrams M-10. And everyone already called it a MAC.

The Cobray Logo was invented by Wayne Daniel the owner of RPB. He did that after he got the rights from M.A.C. And all he did was change the M.A.C logo slightly.
TX used cobray’s logo in the 70s when they produced the rights they leased from RPB M-10.

So in short a Cobray is a MAC. Because TX marketed Ingrams M-10s as a MAC-10. And every one else as followed.

Like I said before Cobray is a logo, thats it. The first company to use that logo was MAC Stephensville TX. And they called the firearm a MAC-10

[Misanthropy]

Identical & interchangeable?

Yeah, you try that.. Way to fuck up your wikiphilia again...

Transmitter related: Consider this; the carrier exists at one mile, on standard receivers I've used. The quality of your receiver is nearly as important as the quality of your transmitter. Once the component values are fine tuned & circuit layout properly executed, this design, such as I recall it from over a decade of memory, did provide viable audio at around a mile. If this is a problem for you, build it, tune it, test it & show your work.

That could be one weak point of your radios in Iraq. There may also be atmospheric considerations at play. This works here. Never had much inclination to test it in Iraq. Perhaps you could.

More to the point: I've already posted the Cobray docs, here are the MAC's. Feel free to see that they are not identical.

Ingram MAC-10 Full Auto Conversion.pdf
MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service

Mod Edit; there's a thread for the transmitter discussion. Use that.

[Albert-sven]

*begins to bash head against keyboard at wall of text*
Alrighty, from my area to get a legal firearm is a pain in the ass. Firearm safety courses,restricted firearms safety courses,application's for a PAL or a RPAL,idiotic mag cap's, and so forth. Yet it takes me 300 dollars and a thirty minute walk to get a pistol downtown from a apartment.

A easy firearm to get around here (illegal) would have to be a .22 semi auto pistol or rifle,then a 9mm handgun,and of course the good old 12ga shotgun(mainly pump, but from time to time a single shot) then you have to go out of town to get the high end shit(i.e deer rifles,semi auto centerfire rifles,full auto centerfire rifles,semi auto shotguns,ect)

*cough*

[thedutchguy]

does anyone know which europe country has the softest gunlaws and it is not a problem buying one without a license legaly (i mean hand guns and such) pls pm

[FerretBone]

I have a friend in Italy, no license to own a shotgun, no license to own military type weapons, no mag limits for handguns and shotguns. I'd go with Italy.



Miss Anthropy,

Your link to a Full auto Ingram vs semi auto “Cobray” is not the same argument. Or the same weapon, It’s not even the same category. Because Ingram never made a simi auto MAC


1. I don’t need to look at your internet linked diagrams when I have the fucking firearms in front of me.

2. The term Mac, is the name of a firearm made by three out of four, of the first manufactures,. Those manufactures called them MACs, as a tribute and credit to Ingram. Cobray was the logo stamped on them latter. Cobray did not manufacturer M-10s. They didnt manufacturer M-10s or MACs. They couldn't becase it was a fucking label used by RPB. The term Cobary used by some people, only refer to a few MAC's. (Which are manufacturered by other companies who called them MAC) The name, MAC refers to all Ingram M-10’s, open bolt simi MACs, and full auto versions made by all other companies of those times.

3. Stay focused…………

Quote - (you)

“Third, I never said anything about modifying an Uzi; only the Cobray. The two of which are designed in completely different ways”

It’s not called a Cobray. You know that now. It’s a MAC, And if you mod’ed one it was made and marketed under the name MAC by one of two companies. No matter how you look at it, your open bolt was a MAC.
From the 70’s through 86 the Model-10 (fullauto) from Ingram was made by many companies and “They functioned the same.” -(Ferretbone) Fullauto that is. Simi auto open bolts were made by two companies until 1982, and “They functioned the same.” -(Ferretbone)

RPB, and TX MAC made open bolt MAC's until 82. Because the ATF shut Daniel down (RPB) and then he latter started SWD in his wifes name. But SWD did not make open bolts. That’s why he changed the name of his company in the first place, because he lost all of his money in that battle, which he lost. The ATF said that open bolt MAC's were machineguns, becasue they were easy to mod. And RPB went under.

With that said, RPB, and TX MAC were the only guys who made an open bolt simi auto MAC. ONCE AGAIN, Cobray was the logo stamped on them regardless who made them. And seeing how you supposedly mod’ed an open bolt to full auto, then it was an RPB or TX MAC, not a Cobray.

And those "functioned the same" period. Sorry you were wrong. Plus, It is in no way called a Cobray. That's two strikes in one sentence. Lets go for three, in the same sentence.



Yes, there are many versions of MAC's model with many differences. There are even Macs made in china, and other countries. But that is not what you were talking about were you? You are talking about an RPB or TX MAC. Because you said you mod'ed one once from simi to fullauto.

Again, you are wrong, or a liar, or both.

Pick one

The weapon is not a Cobray,
The weapon functions the same as other Mac open bolts,
You didn't mod or convert shit....................All the above???????????

[Misanthropy]

Originally Posted by FerretBone

1: I’ll try it this way. Because I’m really wasting a lot of time with this. M-10 Cobray, Ingram, whatever, it’s a moot point, and irrelevant.

2: It is common knowledge that Ingram designed and produced the M-10. Period.

3: Like I said before Cobray is a logo, thats it. The first company to use that logo was MAC Stephensville TX. And they called the firearm a MAC-10

4: It’s not called a Cobray. You know that now. It’s a MAC, And if you mod’ed one it was made and marketed under the name MAC by one of two companies. No matter how you look at it, your open bolt was a MAC.

1: Yes, yes you are, so why are you still yammering?

2: Yes, they did. Cobray (company, not logo) sells their M10 as a Cobray M10, it is not called a mac, sorry.

3: Cobray Company the Firearm Company that Made the 80's Roar
Feel free to note the different naming conventions.

4: The Mod- I was referring to post ban, closed bolt, Cobray, semi auto PM11, as shown. Modifiable. Not M10. I never claimed to own the M10.
What are you missing here?

[FerretBone]

Originally Posted by Misanthropy

1: Yes, yes you are, so why are you still yammering?

2: Yes, they did. Cobray (company, not logo) sells their M10 as a Cobray M10, it is not called a mac, sorry.

3: Cobray Company the Firearm Company that Made the 80's Roar
Feel free to note the different naming conventions.

4: The Mod- I was referring to post ban, closed bolt, Cobray, semi auto PM11, as shown. Modifiable. Not M10. I never claimed to own the M10.
What are you missing here?

The ATF approved the sale of your post ban pistol, the PM-11 in the 90s, which is the same as the banned gun SWDs M-11 except,

Quote ATF- “it has an unthreaded barrel, {b]it’s closed bolt{/b], uses a 10 round magazine, and has a different way of latching the magazine than the M11/9.” The reason for their approval.

Tell me again how you mod’ed a close bolt PM-11 by shaving off a little metal. Just admitt it, you dont know shit about these firearms. You didn't mod a Pm-11.
1. Your diagram was for an open bolt, preban M-11. And they don't cost 300 or 400 hundred dollars.
2. Your PM-11 can not be mod'ed to fullauto. Thats why the ATF approved it after 1994.



A history lesson once again,
Cobray is the label that Daniel used on all his firearms. Because his company, that manufactured them changed damn near once a year. It
was the only way he could put his name on his firearms That way his customers loyal to him and his product would know it was still him producing whatever MAC he was selling at that time.

Daniel the owner of RPB, SWD, and Leinad (his name spelled backwards) shut down his last company because of constant legal battles. The Cobray Trademark was then registered to Harvey Demars, who died this month 9/3/09. Demars, the company you linked, manufactures parts and accessories for all of Daniel’s MACs. They do not sell or manufacture firearms.

And on the website you linked it says, and I’m quoting from the history page

“In the early 1970s, the rights to the gun/suppresser combination were purchased by MAC (Military Armament Corporation) and the guns became known as the MAC-10 and MAC-11. Unfortunately WerBell and Ingram lost control of the company at this point and the new owners practically booted both of them out of the operation. “

Your own link admits they are known as MACs.


There is only one problem with the diagram you posted on how to "convert a semi auto Ingram to fullauto." Ingram never made a simi auto Mac. He only made fullauto. RPB bought all the blue prints and frames Ingram had. Finished them over stamped them, then sold them. Later RPB made the first semi auto version of Ingrams Mac.

Those books are shit, quit wasting your money on them. Or at least quit posting their misinformation here.

[Misanthropy]

Yes, they "became known as macs". But that is NOT what they're sold as now. MAC is now slang. It is not a proper name for currently marketed firearms. What don't you understand?

I never posted anything for a semi auto Ingram. Never claimed to. Semi auto COBRAY is what I posted.

The books are published for a reason; they work. If they don't, why don't YOU publish one that does? Hmm?